Advice needed: Is 7.1 that much better than 5.1 in my Set up?

[jbasch99]

I am currently running a 5.1 Set up with Martin Logan Speakers all the way around and an HSU sub. My room has my couch / listening location at the back of the room with my Martin Logan speakers pointing in toward the couch. The room is approximately 17 feet wide. My question is, would I benefit that much by adding to speakers above the listening location or should I stick with the processor converting 7.2+ signals down to 5.1? At this time my extra two speakers would not be Martim Logan's they would be smaller book shelf type speakers that I would mount to the wall.

It probably needs to be a noticable difference or the wife will not allow me to mount more speakers to the wall.

Thoughts / Reccomenations?

 

[Tony V.]

Hi, you mention that your room is 17 ft wide how long is it? 7.1 or flavors there of is better if the room is large enough, the issue is placement of speakers. You dont want them to close to each other or you end up with for lack of a better word "mud" you start to loose imaging and channel separation. The point of surround is to have sound immerse you but also flow through or around the room. If speakers are too close the sound tends to blend together.

 

[jbasch99]

Hi, you mention that your room is 17 ft wide how long is it? 7.1 or flavors there of is better if the room is large enough, the issue is placement of speakers. You dont want them to close to each other or you end up with for lack of a better word "mud" you start to loose imaging and channel separation. The point of surround is to have sound immerse you but also flow through or around the room. If speakers are too close the sound tends to blend together.

Sorry I should have mentioned it's about 18 ft. deep. so sitting about 15 ft from from speakers.

 

[jbasch99]

I am concerned about the mud you mention as my couch is up against the back wall.

 

[Tony V.]

In your case 7.1 would not be any advantage given the seating location. Ideally you want the seating to be away from a wall at least a few feet but as we all know compromises need to be made especially if WAF is a factor or the space is multi purpose.

 

[jbasch99]

In your case 7.1 would not be any advantage given the seating location. Ideally you want the seating to be away from a wall at least a few feet but as we all know compromises need to be made especially if WAF is a factor or the space is multi purpose.

Perfect that is what I was thinking but wanted to validate. Yes WAF is an issue. It was pushing it to get 5 Martin Logan speakers in the room.

 

[Todd Anderson]

When you say "above the listening location," what do you mean?

 

[jbasch99]

When you say "above the listening location," what do you mean?

Since my couch is up against the back wall I'd have to place the speakers on the wall above the couch. I can't put them in the ceiling, but can put them on the wall above the couch. I am concerned the sound would actually get muddied, since the Logan's' are on the back wall pointing into the listening position.

 

[Todd Anderson]

Some folks aren't big on jumping from 5.1 to 7.1. I'm actually a big proponent of the added sound. That being said, I think your couch-to-wall position is going to eliminate any benefits you might get. If you can manage about 4-ft of space between the couch and the wall, you'll be good to go. But firing directly overhead... meh... stick with 5.1.

 

[jbasch99]

Some folks aren't big on jumping from 5.1 to 7.1. I'm actually a big proponent of the added sound. That being said, I think your couch-to-wall position is going to eliminate any benefits you might get. If you can manage about 4-ft of space between the couch and the wall, you'll be good to go. But firing directly overhead... meh... stick with 5.1.

Can't manage the 4 feet, so I guess I am staying 5.1 sort of what I was thinking but did want to hear from others in case I was missing something.

 

[Todd Anderson]

If you were able to rig them down firing at an angle (where ceiling meets wall) over top of your surround channels, you could play around with a 5.1.2 Atmos set-up. You could test it out by using some 2x4s to temporarily place the speakers. I *think* you'd like what you'd hear!

 

[jbasch99]

And this is why I come to this forum. Not sure why I did not think of the 2x4 as a temp solution, but it's brilliant. The speakers I would put there are Polk audio and were designed to be mounted on the wall. Which would put them naturally pointing on a 45 degree angle. Not sure I can get them to fire direct down. I'd have to put some more thought to that..

thanks.

 

[Todd Anderson]

Definitely keep them over top of the surrounds. And if they are in the corners, it's okay to have them at a 45deg angle. Play with it and see what you think. Personally, I think you'll like what your hear when you play atmos content.

The other position would angled from the corner wall points about 1/2 way between your seating and your front wall. You could have them fire back toward your seating position.

Neither are technically ideal... but I think both are definitely worth trying.

 

[ddude003]

Hello Jbasch99, As for your speaker question, I might even try adding the 2 new speakers as front height left and rights... Martin Logan makes some nice surrounds and book shelfs... I use Motion 4s and like them a lot... Now for that couch at the back wall... As others have suggested move it forward as much as possible and think about adding broadband absorption and/or diffusion on that back wall behind the listening position... Dealing with that reflection point will help a lot...

 

[jbasch99]

I might be able to get the option of above my current surrounds past the WAF. Especially since my current surrounds are in the corner pointing towards the couch. I don’t think she would go for the mid room option. In the case of above the current sourrounds would you configure it as Atmos 5.1.2 or. 7.1 set up? Sorry Atmos is new to me.

 

[Todd Anderson]

It would 5.1.2. The two Atmos channels would basically be considered Top Middle.

Something worth trying as a temporary install with 2x4s... You might find it introduces nothing... or you might like it a lot.

Do you have ready access to any Atmos material?

 

[jbasch99]

No on Atmos material as Atmos is new to me, unless it's on 4KHD DVD's. Any recommendations on where to get some Atmos source material?

 

[Todd Anderson]

First you need an Atmos capable receiver -- do you have that?

For source material, you can always enter our DTS demo disc giveaway (https://www.avnirvana.com/threads/p...e-test-with-this-awesome-flash-giveaway.3653/), which would give you an immersive experience if your receiver is DTS:X compatible. It also has test sounds, etc, for immersive speaker arrangements.

Aside from that, you just have to track down some of the more notable flicks with Atmos encodes. Invincible is a good one (the bombing/dogfight scene at the beginning is great demo material). Also Gravity (Diamond Luxe Edition) is a fantastic Atmos demo piece. The first 15 min are still some of my favorite Atmos material. And Deepwater Horizon is phenomenal demo material.

 

[jbasch99]

I did join the demo give away. These are great options thanks.

 

[Tony V.]

Glad we could help, stick around and feel free to participate in discussions on other topics. We have a great bunch of people on here with alot of knowledge in many different areas.

 

[jbasch99]

I agree and they have me thinking about Atmos. Along those lines and in ceiling mounted speakers that are wireless or partially wireless recommended in the Atmos space? If I can make them seamless they might pass the WAF. Wires exposed will not.

 

[Tony V.]

Wireless speakers still require power so if you can get power to them you would have no issues with going that route. There are several wireless options available but the receiver must have analog outputs for Atmos in order for that to be used. Some newer receivers have wireless built in (I believe Yamaha announced one or two that do this.)

 

[jbasch99]

It looks like I am going to settle on the Yamaha unit which has both front and rear special effect speakers as an option. I have 4 speakers available for this use. I am planning to use 2 up front as front affect speakers. That leaves 2 for the back. My couch is on the back wall so I plan to place the speakers in the corner facing the couch above the current back speakers in my 5.1 set up. The question becomes with the yamaha, do I wire them as back surrounds or rear effect speakers and any knowledge what I might gain / give up in various circumstances?

I hope this makes sense.

 

[Todd Anderson]

Which Yamaha model are you looking at?

 

[jbasch99]

Found a deal local to me on a 2070 so going to likely go that route.