Outlaw Audio Model 976 7.2 Surround Processor Review

Manufacturer & Model
Outlaw Audio Model 976 7.2 Surround Processor
MSRP
$929
Link
https://bit.ly/2xf7whK
Highlights
Dolby TrueHD, Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby Digital, DTS-HD Master Audio, DTS-HD High-Resolution Audio and DTS decoding, balanced and conventional outputs in a 7.2 configuration fed by high quality DACs, 7.1 analog inputs, 4 HDMI 4K/HDR Inputs, 2 HDMI Outputs (1 HDMI 2.0b/ HDCP 2.2 output), 192 kHz 24-bit DAC's for all channels.
Summary
Outlaw Audio's Model 976 is a quality piece of gear with impressive build characteristics, high-quality internal electronics, capable firmware with flexible parametric EQ, and amazing sound. If you are in the market for a highly capable surround processor with HDMI 2.1 performance, this model should be on your shortlist. Priced at $929, the Outlaw Audio Model 976 represents an excellent value.
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The Outlaw Audio Model 976 processor is an exciting and feature-packed home theater processor from a company known for no-nonsense high-value offerings. The 976 is a 7.1 channel surround processor offering high-quality sound, flexible implementation offerings, and a modest price. While it doesn’t offer immersive surround formats such as Atmos, for those not interested in adding this feature, you get a processor that does everything else extremely well.

When discussing the Model 976 with Peter Tribeman, a founder of Outlaw Audio, he frequently relayed the notion that Outlaw Audio would never release a product they couldn’t afford to buy themselves. You will never see needlessly expensive luxury audio gear, and the features they include are the ones they most want themselves. That has allowed them to put together a product that, once set up properly, works as expected. This philosophy aligns with my top requirements for any piece of audio gear, but especially highly complex products such as surround processors. It needs to work reliably and perform as intended 100-percent of the time.

During my time with the Outlaw 976, I can happily say it worked flawlessly, with no operational problems or sound quality issues (at least none that I can blame on Outlaw). Watching movies or listening to music was immensely enjoyable, and the sound quality improvement it afforded over my current Onkyo surround processor was immediately evident. To learn more about the 976 and why I liked it so much, continue below.


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Outlaw Audio Model 976 Unboxing and Features
Opening the 976 was reminiscent of experiencing old-school American muscle. I knew this product was safe because it was double boxed in heavy cardboard with large molded foam inserts, the same way the best gear has been packaged for decades. I must be honest, while I like the new packaging techniques, I don’t like having to find all the accessories in the hidden compartments. With the Model 976, it was refreshing to see all the accessories clearly laid out in the box.

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As for the feature set, this is both a highly complex and yet intuitively simple device. It’s not perfect, which I will discuss, but for most buyers this has the exact features they’ll need. The Model 976 includes HDMI inputs and outputs that support the most current 4K and HDR formats (HDMI 2.0b with HDCP 2.2 compliance), fully balanced and unbalanced inputs and outputs for a full 7.1 system (Some call this a 7.2 processor, but the subwoofer channels are not individually addressable, so I say it is a .1 not .2 product), and decoding for all current surround formats with the exception of Atmos, DTS-X, and the like.

Around back you find a much more complex device. As with any surround processor, one look at the back of this product can feel intimidating. Yet it is very well laid out and easy to connect. Given that it’s a state of the art 7.1 processor, the fact there aren’t more connections is a miracle. What you find are 7.1 channels of balanced outputs across the bottom (two subwoofer outs), 7.1 channels of single-ended outputs above them, four analogue inputs simply labeled 1 through 4, a 7.1 channel input, two optical and two coaxial digital inputs, an RS-232 input for firmware updates, antennae inputs, a Bluetooth input which allows for the addition of an optional Bluetooth module (and future upgrades to the module as technology changes), six HDMI inputs (five on the back, four of which are HDCP2.2 compliant, and one on the front), two HDMI outputs (one is HDCP 2.2 compliant), a set of IR inputs and outputs, trigger controls, and two USB power ports (they are not used to input sound, just power).

This kind of connectivity set is great for custom installers or consumers looking to add greater integration, while not being too complex for the target buyer. Outlaw Ben Brewer (Product Manager) tells me that the inclusion of an older non-HDCP 2.2 compliant HDMI input was targeted toward older HDMI gear that sometimes doesn’t play nice with the newest standards. All in all, I find this a very well thought out package, clearly, the Outlaws know what they are doing.

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Now all of these nice inputs, outputs, and decoding capabilities would be nothing if not for the software that brings it all together. This is where I need to give you my opinion of this product both from the standpoint of its target buyer and my own personal preferences. I also need to mention a quirk in the software, but as we will discuss, this quirk is not the fault of Outlaw and, in fact, likely exists in all products using the same chipset.



We should all petition Texas Instruments!
Let’s start by discussing one of the major selling points of this processor, its EQ features. Each channel is said to have 10 channels of PEQ. However, I need to explain what that means in practice and what the Outlaws have said is technically true (I personally find it a little misleading). In fact, the processor has ten channels of processing that’s applied to each channel prior to bass management, each with eight bands of traditional parametric EQ (amplitude, Q, and center frequency), and two shelf filters, one high and one low. Shelf filters are handy for adjusting the overall tonal balance of a system. They allow you to shelve down the treble a few dB’s and shelve up the bass a few dB’s creating a pleasant house curve. Accessing and adjusting the bands is cumbersome, I have to admit longing for another means to make such adjustments. If Outlaw would release a software app that allowed you to connect via RS-232 to upload the EQ bands, that would make setup easier. Nonetheless, it was doable using the remote and didn’t take very long. It’s also no more difficult to set up than any competing product with manual EQ facilities; my complaint is more general: the industry should embrace better ways to set up its hardware (and certainly some have). Smartphone apps, web interfaces, or computer programs would all be appreciated options in my opinion.

Next, we have the bass management and level setting portion of the 976. For this, the Model 976 threw me for a loop, but in its defense, Outlaw is clear in their instructions and FAQ (I am a typical guy however and did not read the directions). I plugged in an included measurement microphone, set it in my primary listening position, and ran the tests.

“Huh, that’s strange,” I thought, it doesn’t seem to recognize what speakers I have hooked up?

Well, that would be because I was supposed to tell it that ahead of time. I went back into the menu and established which speakers I had hooked up and their size/crossover point. I re-ran the measurements and it established the level and distance for me. Outlaw Audio made a conscious choice to limit the setup flexibility of the bass management in a way that I didn’t personally like. My preference is to run the mains full range with subwoofers such that there is no crossover between the mains and subs. They both operate at LF’s at the same time, overlapping in response in a critical zone. I prefer this because it increases the number of low-frequency sources in a critical area of modal behavior and helps improve bass smoothness and spatial consistency. However, this is achieved through careful set up, often aided by measurements and some knowledge of the concept and how it works. Otherwise, it tends to just make things worse. This is a common experience shared by some past Outlaw users, and to avoid this problem Outlaw decided not to include this bass management approach. As such, if you run the speakers as large or full range, the subs will not operate except for LFE duty. This being the case, I ran the speakers as small, set to 60Hz. The main purpose of the microphone and automatic setup was to establish the distance and relative levels between speakers. In the end, using measurements, I made some adjustments. My highly unusual and complex LF setup caused some confusion for the algorithm that sets subwoofer distance, and so I needed to manually adjust this until the time delay between the subwoofers and mains was minimized. Since I use a four subwoofer setup with digital signal processing in my external amplifiers, the fact that my system threw off the automatic distance settings is not a knock on the device, none have ever gotten it right. In the end, while I was left wishing for more setup flexibility in the bass management, I do understand the decisions made by the Outlaw Audio team. This product was intended to be easy to set up and use, adding extra flexibility for more complex or advanced setups would have made the product harder to use, harder for Outlaw to support, and ultimately more expensive. Given a choice of one or the other, I too would pick the simpler route.

The remote is a nice looking aluminum bar with white buttons that glow blue. Anyone with a complex home theater may integrate it with a universal control system and ditch the remote, but I’d guess most users will use it (and it worked great).


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Outlaw also sells a Bluetooth module (not reviewed) for $49.99. The module is removable and likely upgradeable as technologies change.

Finally, it’s worth mentioning that that the processor has unusually good parts for its price class (Burr Brown PCM1794a DAC and OPA1652). These parts are similar to those found in high-end 2-channel gear.


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Earlier, I referenced a certain quirk inherent in the TI DA808 chipset. The problem is the signal flow path that TI has chosen and what this does to the final product. The way in which the chip operates, the PEQ is applied to the discrete 7.1 channels before bass management. After EQ is applied, bass management is applied, which redirects a portion of the signal to other speakers. Here in lies the problem: you are EQ-ing the source, not the speaker, and that isn’t intuitive since the EQ’s purpose is to correct the speaker and room. This is problematic because if you are trying to remove the effects of room modes in the low frequencies, intuitively you would select the subwoofer or LFE channel to apply EQ. However, problematic low frequencies are likely coming from the main channels and being redirected to the subwoofer. Consequently, you need to apply that cut to the main left and right channel. This process can be a bit confusing at first, but once you understand how it works, applying EQ is very simple and very effective. This quirk would certainly not keep me from recommending this product (or owning it myself).

Once I identified the problem, I was able to make great use of the EQ, but I can absolutely see this non-sensical signal path causing problems for other end users. While talking with Ben, he indicated he was working on an EQ instruction document for owners, designed to ensure they make better decisions than I initially did. In my case, it turned out to be an invaluable tool. I only wish that TI would move the EQ filters after the bass management so that the EQ is being applied to the speaker, not the incoming signal.

Before and after EQ (Left, Center, and Left Surround)


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Note, before EQ there were some differences in the response shape, poor subwoofer integration between channels, and a prominent peak in the treble of the main speakers caused by the B&C DE250 at 18kHz.

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Careful response shaping allowed for better subwoofer integration with the different speaker channels such that the match between channels was much improved. The peak in the treble was removed from the mains with a small bit of EQ, which helped provide a response balance more similar to that of the surrounds. Further, a shelf filter was added to ensure a similar response shape across all the speakers.


Model 976 Sound
I often think of myself as being a very pragmatic audiophile. That is, I recognize the differences in sound quality between good and bad gear, I recognize why some gear costs more, and I will spend more money to get better sound. On the other hand, I tend to use average quality signal cables, inexpensive bulk speaker cable, and I don’t buy into a lot of the more unusual ideas around how to get better sound. Some of this comes from experience. I’ve tried expensive cables and I didn’t find the difference to be notable or clearly better. I’ve also tried various tweaks, isolation platforms, built amplifiers and speaker crossovers with high-end capacitors and resistors, etc. In the end, I’ve found some parts make a difference to a point, while others do not (for example, in crossovers the better poly film capacitors tend to sound better in crossover series components than do electrolytic, but Teflon film and oil don’t necessarily sound better than a more basic film and foil type). I tell you this story to explain that I went into this review expecting the surround processor to sound no different than my current Onkyo receiver, but to offer more flexibility. Instead, I was absolutely shocked by the change in sound I heard once the Model 976 was installed. In order to allow an A/B comparison, I connected the processor through my receiver, using the amplifiers in the receiver to power my system. This way I could quickly switch back and forth for a more instantaneous and accurate evaluation. While I did eventually bypass the receiver using external amps, this was a good test. With the Outlaw 976 in the signal path and the receiver in bypass mode (essentially a direct connection to the amplifier), I found the sound brighter (but not unnaturally so) and a bit more transparent. Now, bright sometimes comes off as transparent, so I wasn’t sure of what I was hearing. I shared this finding with a fellow reviewer who was highly skeptical and suggested I quantify my impressions with measurements. I did, finding the Onkyo’ s own processing caused a more rolled off response as compared to the Outlaw. The Onkyo also had an order of magnitude higher distortion, such that I could easily read it above the distortion of the measurement interface. The Outlaw had the same residual distortion as the measurement interface, suggesting I was just measuring the distortion and noise of the device itself. In other words, the Outlaw was both more extended in the high frequencies and of lower distortion. My ears did not lie, I wasn’t nuts, the Outlaw really did sound different, and the measurements sure suggested that this difference was due to objectively better performance.


Listening Tests
As for sound, it’s always hard for me to describe my experience with something like a surround processor. I certainly put it through its paces, playing a variety of music and movies. All were always enjoyable. Did I enjoy it more than before? Yes, I think I did. I really didn’t want to send the Outlaw Model 976 back and would have been happy to keep it in my system long term. The differences between the new processor and my old setup were subtle enough that it wasn’t always obvious what I was hearing. Some of the things I liked weren’t even related to its sound. For example, I preferred its PEQ on each channel and general setup flexibility. While the bass management didn’t suit me, I could easily bypass it and perform external bass management that met my needs. The system worked well and sounded great when set up this way. The perception of more extended highs and greater transparency wasn’t immediately obvious in listening tests, more of an impression left with me after I listened for a while, switching back and forth.

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To start off my music listening, I queued up one of my favorite albums by Lewis Nash, which I described as follows in my NAD C368 review:

“One of my all-time favorite test albums for drums and soundstage is by a wonderful bebop jazz drummer named Lewis Nash. The album, entitled It Don’t Mean a Thing, a reference to Duke Ellington’s hit song, is one of the best bebop jazz albums I’ve ever heard (and he’s even better life). It’s clearly a fully improvised jazz set, as it should be, but is often not the case in studio albums. Nobody was worried about getting the performance just so, everyone just grooved together, and the chemistry and magic of a great improvised jazz piece are obvious.”

“Caravan” has a great rhythmic drum beat that is both audibly impressive and revealing of lesser systems. Through the 976 I found a perfectly accurate portrayal of the sound. Lewis Nash uses a close-up multi-mic setup on the drum that is produced into a larger than life drum set with substantial width and depth. As Nash plays on the toms (his set is depicted as having two) you can hear a clear left and right channel separation, with what I would describe as a dry jazzy sound. He experiments with the portion of the head he plays and the change in sound is subtle but clear. On lesser systems this can go unnoticed. In fact, I first heard it on headphones, later noticing it more clearly on better quality playback systems. With the Model 976, the change in timbre as different parts of the head are played was clear. The visceral component, as well as the leading edge of the beat to the bass drum, came through clearly. On lesser systems, the bass drum tends to just sound boomy.


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I spent quite a lot of time listening to TIDAL HiFi and TIDAL Masters with my laptop as a source. Here’s a sampling of the music I listened to with some brief reactions:

Yo-Yo Ma and Kathryn Stott’s Songs from the Arc of Life, “Ave Maria." This is a beautiful song and one that causes a pilomotor reflex in me (goosebumps and raised hair), a proven measure of emotional response. After listening to certain pieces enough times I find that my emotional reaction fades as I become accustomed to the piece, and while I might enjoy it, it isn’t the same as the first time. When I queued this up to playback on the Outlaw, it was as if I was hearing it for the first time. I was lost in the music. The processor did nothing to harm this great recording, with a very clear and coherent presentation.
Mozart’s “Requiem: Amen” performed by the Boston Baroque and Martin Pearlman is a classic Mozart choral piece. This piece builds with grand drama at a pace modern attention deprived audiences can barely stand. This short building fugue is a great musical test piece as it contains both a large dynamic rise and wonderful silence between the notes. The 976 delivered a beautiful reproduction of this piece, nothing added, nothing taken away.



Movies
I watched The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies as part of this review. There is no denying the visual and aural effects of the Tolkien based movies, so this seemed like a fitting way to review the processor's prowess. This movie includes a great DTS-HD Master Audio 7.1 soundtrack and the 976 delivered an enveloping soundscape. I found, at times, that the soundtrack spooked me, causing me to pause the film and check for unexpected noises. Where some movies provide surround effects in a manner that is more a distraction than an enhancement, that was not the case here. Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying the 976 did anything magical here, it did exactly what it was supposed to do. It reproduced this soundtrack just as it was encoded, with nothing added or taken away. The slightly brighter presentation seemed to help with dialogue clarity. On the other hand, I don’t generally like a brighter presentation, so I found myself pausing the film and adding a few dBs of treble reduction using the shelf filter. It took just a few seconds to do this, and I was back in the action. That is one of the nice things about this processor, you can make basic adjustments like this to taste.

Thor: Ragnarök is another one of those action films where, regardless of your opinions on the acting or story, the action, visuals, and sound are undeniably spectacular. Relying upon another DTS-HD Master Audio 7.1 soundtrack, I found the encode’s aural effects and enveloping soundscape to be impressive. Highlighted by Hulk and Thor battle scenes that present low-frequency effects that best be described as an assault. As I explored the outer limits of this soundtrack, the 976 issued a clear and effortless sound even as pushed volume levels to the extreme. Even as my house shook, I found myself thoroughly impressed by the processor’s ability to drive a clean and enveloping presentation.



CONCLUSION
The Outlaw Audio Model 976 has been on my shortlist of processors I’d like to own and it didn’t disappoint. It’s an excellent piece of gear with a high-quality build, high-quality internal electronics, capable firmware with excellent flexible parametric EQ, and amazing sound. My quibbles with the bass management or wishing for easier set up are minor when considering how well the product worked once it was properly integrated, its reliable performance, and how wonderful it sounded. If you are in the market for a highly capable surround processor with excellent sound, the Outlaw Audio Model 976 is highly recommended. And at a price of $929, it’s an excellent value.


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Specifications
  • Surround Formats: Dolby TrueHD, Dolby Digital Plus, and Dolby Digital decoding; DTS-HD Master Audio, DTS-HD High-Resolution Audio and DTS decoding
  • Surround Upsampling: Dolby Pro Logic IIx, Dolby Pro Logic II, and DTS NEO:6 processing
  • 10 band PEQ per channel
  • All Channels Stereo
  • Advanced Dual Core DSP
  • HDMI Standby Pass-Thru
  • Quadruple Crossover control
  • Lip Sync Delay
  • On Screen Display
  • 192kHz 24-bit Dacs for all channels (Burr Brown PCM 1794a)
  • High-Quality opamp output stage (OPA1652)
  • 4 HDMI 4K/HDR Inputs
  • 2 HDMI 1080p inputs, 1 on the rear panel, 1 on front
  • 2 HDMI outputs, 1 HDMI 2.0b/ HDCP 2.2
  • 7.2 XLR/RCA Pre-amp outputs
  • 4 Digital inputs (2 coaxial, 2 optical)
  • 7.1 Analog Audio input
  • 4 Stereo Analog Audio Inputs
  • High-performance Tuner
  • Direct access station tuning via remote control
  • 5-volt trigger
  • Advanced Config. Settings
  • Discrete IR on/off and input commands
  • Aluminum Front Panel & Remote
  • S/N Ratio: 112 dB

Extended Measurements
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Stepped Sine Distortion with all EQ turned off. Completely flat response and distortion vanishingly low, .003% or less THD. I measured a noise floor of -105 dB, but note that this is likely the limit of my sound interface and not this processor.

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Stepped Sine Subwoofer channel, shows a 4th order roll-off at 200Hz and vanishingly low noise and distortion.

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Onkyo vs Outlaw response difference. Note the clear evidence that the Outlaw is operating in 96kHz whereas the Onkyo is operating in 44kHz with a slow roll-off filter. The bass response of the two looks identical because my measurement interface was the limiting factor in this case.
 
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ereed

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Jun 23, 2017
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Thanks Matthew for the review! Looks like a top quality product without all the latest bells and whistles.

I currently have Rotel 1068 prepro (2004 era) and is lacking hdmi and lossless codecs and I'm not interested in atmos right now. So this sound like a perfect solution for me to get hdmi connection without making any major changes to my 7.1 speaker configuration while trying to save as much money as possible. And if I wanted to get dirac room correction I could simply not use any PEQ in the Outlaw and just keep it off and add something like minidsp 88a which has dirac to go between outlaw processor and my amp.

So this sounds like perfect solution to keep 7.1 but improve sound quality with better dacs, get hdmi connection, lossless codecs without having to spend much more on avr with all the bells and whistles I don't care for.
 

tony359

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Mar 23, 2018
Posts
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Hi there - I live in the UK and this preamp has caught my attention. However, it does not seem to be available other than in the US and also seems to only work with 110V supply. My current preamp is also 110V so that's not too much a big deal but just wondering if anybody knew an European reseller? I'm mostly concerned about warranty to be honest. Thanks!
 

Kal Rubinson

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What is happening is that EQ is being applied to bass management and then routed through bass management to the respective channel you have managed the signal. So bass management takes the low frequencies from the mains and routes it to the subwoofer. When you apply eq to the LFE channel, that isn’t the subwoofer. So the room problems aren’t corrected at the subwoofer for any low frequencies being routed to the sub. The only problems that are corrected are the LFE channel material. In order to ensure the L and R channel bass is corrected, you have to apply the eq to the L and R channels. Because it’s all rerouted to the sub, the effect is summative.
It is a shame that this foolish quirk persists in AVR configurations after a decade (or more). Clearly the message never gets far enough upstream to the chip makers.
 

phil faulds

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Jul 2, 2018
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Hi all
I replaced my 975 with a 976 mostly on the basis of this review, and am very impressed with the PEQ and sonic improvements. (In my environment, the 975 was plagued with ground loop/hum problems.)

However, I've run into one bizarre issue that Outlaw says can't be happening, so I wanted to check if anybody else had experienced a similar issue.
When I play a surround SACD from my Sony BDP6700 over HDMI (also with a neighbor's Sony BD player), the 976 recognizes the source as PCM 5.1 but, depending on the disc, drops either the left or both surround channels. For Pentatone SACDs, both surround channels are silent; for other labels (DG, Water Lily, Alia Vox) only the right channel plays.

It's very strange, since DVDs and BDs played on the same device play properly.

To confirm that the 976 was the issue, I hauled out my 975, hooked it up to the Sony and ran the surround channels into my headphone amp. This is a minimal test case to eliminate all unnecessary potential sources of problems. The 975 played surround information from all Pentatone and Water Lily SACDs. Switching out the 975 for the 976, the 976 displayed the same issue: either one or both surround channels was lost, even though PCM 5.1 was indicated on the front panel.

So, to sum up:
- discs contain surround info
- surround is processed by 975
- surround channels are partially or wholly dropped by 976 with same source configuration

Has anybody else used the 976 for playback of surround SACDs and did you experience the same issue?
I don't think this is game over for the 976, but it certainly is annoying: I don't have any other means of playing or ripping those discs. It was a bad format from the get-go.

I've tried all settings on the Sony and the 976, and have found none that work.

Thanks for your help
Phil
 

Kal Rubinson

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Some of those discs are 5.0 or 4.0 and, if the Outlaw thinks they are 5.1 (rather than up-mixing them to 5.1), it will map the channel outputs incorrectly. This is an old and abiding fault that still pops up with "modern" equipment.
 

phil faulds

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Some of those discs are 5.0 or 4.0 and, if the Outlaw thinks they are 5.1 (rather than up-mixing them to 5.1), it will map the channel outputs incorrectly. This is an old and abiding fault that still pops up with "modern" equipment.
Thanks, Kal
You might have hit on it.
Also, I have no center channel, so that might further confuse the issue.
Sad that the old, sonically inferior 975 handles them and its successor doesn't.
 

phil faulds

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Some of those discs are 5.0 or 4.0 and, if the Outlaw thinks they are 5.1 (rather than up-mixing them to 5.1), it will map the channel outputs incorrectly. This is an old and abiding fault that still pops up with "modern" equipment.

A quick question, sir, if you have time... a solution might be to run the HDMI from the BD player through an Essence HDMI MCH DAC, then run the analog to the 976. I know you've reviewed this DAC positively, and wondered if you noticed if this device had the same problem. I'm not sure that the few surround SACDs I have would make it worthwhile to buy this DAC, but it's something to think about (the Pentatones at least are available for download in MCH). I intend to keep the 976 anyway, because I can't see anything anywhere near the price that will do me as well.
Thanks
Phil
 

Kal Rubinson

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A quick question, sir, if you have time... a solution might be to run the HDMI from the BD player through an Essence HDMI MCH DAC, then run the analog to the 976. I know you've reviewed this DAC positively, and wondered if you noticed if this device had the same problem.
I did not because I no longer play any discs except for movies. All my playback for music is from files bought or ripped. In doing so, the player software (JRiver or Roon) remaps the channels intelligently and consistently.

My suspicions are that the Essence will not because it probably lacks the intelligence/processing to do anything but literal channel-for-channel D/A conversion. The company is run by a very informed and accessible guy and you might want to address this question to him.
 

phil faulds

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I did not because I no longer play any discs except for movies. All my playback for music is from files bought or ripped. In doing so, the player software (JRiver or Roon) remaps the channels intelligently and consistently.

My suspicions are that the Essence will not because it probably lacks the intelligence/processing to do anything but literal channel-for-channel D/A conversion. The company is run by a very informed and accessible guy and you might want to address this question to him.

Thanks, Kal
That's what I suspected... I'll contact Essence if I decide to go this route.
In the meantime, I'll look for a hackable disc player to see if I can't rip these discs. They are getting very scarce.
Phil
 

Kal Rubinson

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Thanks, Kal
That's what I suspected... I'll contact Essence if I decide to go this route.
In the meantime, I'll look for a hackable disc player to see if I can't rip these discs. They are getting very scarce.
Phil
Scarce? There are so many........................................
 

phil faulds

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Jul 2, 2018
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Scarce? There are so many........................................
Most are out of production and/or too expensive, going by the list on Hifi Haven. Unfortunately my Sony is too recent (or I shouldn't have updated the firmware.) I'm in Canada so buying used off eBay or elsewhere is often unreliable, with high shipping/import/brokerage costs. But one will come up one day, I'm sure. That will be the most economical solution. Shoulda bought an Oppo when I had the chance.
 

phil faulds

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Yard sales, pawn shops, Craig's List, Penny-Savers......................

The audio gods were listening, Kal. After years of sporadic searching, a pristine Sony S5100 came up on Kijiji for $30. After a short drive and the usual difficulties that people with tiny brains have with the software, we're off and running, ripping DSD MCH files with no problems (server method only: can't get MCH from AutoRip, unfortunately.)
Keep it real in the round,
Phil
 

cueball9

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Preamp, Processor or Receiver
Outlaw 976
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Outlaw 5000X
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Streaming Subscriptions
Amazon HD
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Wharfdale EVO 4.3
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Wharfdale EVO CS
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Polk OWM5
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Infinity
Video Display Device
Vizio M552-2i
Matthew, thank-you for trying to clear-up how the EQ/LFE works. Can you please explain to me what the "shelf" in the EQ does. Is it a crossover? How do you determine where to set it? Sorry to so late but I just got my 976 and the EQ was....challenging for my set-up guy. And me! Also, do you know if Ben ever finished or published the explanation for the EQ shelf? Thanks so much.
 

dreadknot

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Preamp, Processor or Receiver
outlaw audio 976 7.2 balanced receviver
Main Amp
Crown xli 800 xls 1502
Additional Amp
Crown xli 800 , Crown xli 800
Other Amp
crown xls 1502
Universal / Blu-ray / CD Player
nvidia shield (2017 model)
Streaming Equipment
none
Streaming Subscriptions
none
Front Speakers
PL-89
Center Channel Speaker
PL-28II (for sale)
Surround Speakers
Klipsch RB-81 (sold)
Surround Back Speakers
Klipsch RB-81
Front Height Speakers
none
Rear Height Speakers
none
Subwoofers
none at the moment
Other Speakers
none
Screen
Vizio M55-E0 (2017 model) upgrading to tcl 55in
Video Display Device
none
Remote Control
none
Satellite System
none
Other Equipment
none
i see its now DISCONTINUED is it still good are ther any big bugs or did it just not sell well
 

dreadknot

Member
Supporter
Joined
Jan 31, 2020
Posts
61
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
outlaw audio 976 7.2 balanced receviver
Main Amp
Crown xli 800 xls 1502
Additional Amp
Crown xli 800 , Crown xli 800
Other Amp
crown xls 1502
Universal / Blu-ray / CD Player
nvidia shield (2017 model)
Streaming Equipment
none
Streaming Subscriptions
none
Front Speakers
PL-89
Center Channel Speaker
PL-28II (for sale)
Surround Speakers
Klipsch RB-81 (sold)
Surround Back Speakers
Klipsch RB-81
Front Height Speakers
none
Rear Height Speakers
none
Subwoofers
none at the moment
Other Speakers
none
Screen
Vizio M55-E0 (2017 model) upgrading to tcl 55in
Video Display Device
none
Remote Control
none
Satellite System
none
Other Equipment
none
oh ok but its still preforming great for those how have it no major issues ,iv only had mine about 2-1/2 years now
 

wjw002

Registered
Joined
Jul 7, 2018
Posts
4
What a shame it's a great processor purchased mine in 2018 from Outlaw and it's still going strong with no issues.
 

dreadknot

Member
Supporter
Joined
Jan 31, 2020
Posts
61
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
outlaw audio 976 7.2 balanced receviver
Main Amp
Crown xli 800 xls 1502
Additional Amp
Crown xli 800 , Crown xli 800
Other Amp
crown xls 1502
Universal / Blu-ray / CD Player
nvidia shield (2017 model)
Streaming Equipment
none
Streaming Subscriptions
none
Front Speakers
PL-89
Center Channel Speaker
PL-28II (for sale)
Surround Speakers
Klipsch RB-81 (sold)
Surround Back Speakers
Klipsch RB-81
Front Height Speakers
none
Rear Height Speakers
none
Subwoofers
none at the moment
Other Speakers
none
Screen
Vizio M55-E0 (2017 model) upgrading to tcl 55in
Video Display Device
none
Remote Control
none
Satellite System
none
Other Equipment
none
are ther any needed firmware updates as of now that i should have
 

gp4Jesus

New Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2022
Posts
16
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
Outlaw Audio 976
Main Amp
Several Rotel RB-981s
Additional Amp
2 Rotel RB-980BX
Universal / Blu-ray / CD Player
Samsung 5900 BDP; Phillips CD changer
Streaming Equipment
Fire stick
Streaming Subscriptions
Many
Front Speakers
Polk Audio RTi A7
Center Channel Speaker
CSi A6
Surround Speakers
RTi A3
Subwoofers
4 Audio Pro Subs; LFE Sunfire True Signature
Video Display Device
Samsung 60” LED
Remote Control
Harmony
Satellite System
Dish
Other Equipment
4 EXOs
Thanks Matthew for the review! Looks like a top quality product without all the latest bells and whistles.
I agree

I currently have Rotel 1068 prepro (2004 era) and is lacking hdmi and lossless codecs…
Have you made the move to Outlaw? I dying to know what you like most. For me the SQ improvement.

In 2016 I upgraded* to the Outlaw 975 from the Rotel 1068 that had channel outputs dying one at a time w/absolutely NO regrets! I do NOT miss the add’l cabling one iota! ~3 years ago I upgraded to the 976. Again, w/no regrets!
and I'm not interested in atmos* right now.
I’m kicking it* around, but I think that* will exceed the WAF even in the more spacious “new” room when the herd thins out in 2-3 years.

As a new member I really enjoyed this most informative, comprehensive review, especially that EQ quirk I’m sure has frustrated a few users. I hafta re-read that part again to determine if I can exploit it.

I come from 10 years of pre/pros devoid of any built-in calibration software. I rely upon my knowledge of, beginning w/2 channel, 40 years of study and hands-on to set the Outlaw’s XO frequencies and the speakers to Large or Small. Further, use an RTA, and calibration mic to tweak my system to the room.

All channels, except the LFE have outboard third party DSP driven EXO/PEQ that’s allowed me to nearly avoid using the Outlaw’s PEQs and bass management features. I am forced to rely upon the Outlaw’s PEQ to tune the LFE. I’ve applied a small cut in the middle of its range to flatten it’s otherwise good in-room response.

I’m sorry my first post shouts conceit as I know there are many ways to skin the “audio cat,” and everyone is on a different road to their nirvana. I am eager to fit it to the AudioNirvana culture and to add to my otherwise extremely limited exposure to the newer HT technology.

I’m behind the HDMI knowledge power curve as my current cable don’t support 4K and I have a 4K player on the purchase schedule. I’m asking for suggestions that m, perhaps, rivals the $ a full tank of gas.

A 1000 thanks in advance… Tony
 

ereed

New Member
Joined
Jun 23, 2017
Posts
3
Glad to see you are enjoying yours. I bought mine back in 2020 and love it. While it has no atmos it is a solid prepro for 7.1 layout. Very clean and low noise floor. I have played with peqs and its nice to be able to do anything manually especially copying eq filters from REW directly to the outlaw.
 

gp4Jesus

New Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2022
Posts
16
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
Outlaw Audio 976
Main Amp
Several Rotel RB-981s
Additional Amp
2 Rotel RB-980BX
Universal / Blu-ray / CD Player
Samsung 5900 BDP; Phillips CD changer
Streaming Equipment
Fire stick
Streaming Subscriptions
Many
Front Speakers
Polk Audio RTi A7
Center Channel Speaker
CSi A6
Surround Speakers
RTi A3
Subwoofers
4 Audio Pro Subs; LFE Sunfire True Signature
Video Display Device
Samsung 60” LED
Remote Control
Harmony
Satellite System
Dish
Other Equipment
4 EXOs
I’m glad your another happy 976 owner. Your thoughts on SQ?

For me the 975 was quite the upgrade from the 1068. The 976 took it up another notch.
…especially copying eq filters from REW directly to the outlaw.
copy directly to the Outlaw! I MUST look into REW though transferring its readings to my 3rd party PEQs where I can would work too. Does allow real time analysis?

My beef w/most if not all AVR’s built-in calibration software: I want to see the PEQ settings BEFORE applying them. I don’t want it to PEQ out a large dip in the bass as it’s likely do to a room mode or possibly a flipped polarity of a channel.

Enjoy. Blessings. Tony
 

ereed

New Member
Joined
Jun 23, 2017
Posts
3
I thought the SQ was an improvement mainly due to lower noise floor and better crosstalk channel seperation. One thing I don't like about outlaw is there is no pure analog bypass which I was able to do with my Rotel but I'm not complaining really.

As far as copying PEQs what I did was use eq function in REW and entered the outlaw eq option in REW....then just manually copied the eq filters to the outlaw peq. The pain was having to back out and run sweep again and go back into the menu and it took some time but its nice to get it tweaked how you like it vs the automated room correction if you want to focus on a specific frequency.
 

phil faulds

New Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2018
Posts
21
Hi all
After having my 976 for almost 2 years, I've noticed an apparent flaw that other owners can possibly verify (or not.)
When I play certain material with high energy in the 60-80 Hz range with PEQ on, I get a buzzing sound on the bass peaks. (Think of a loose driver or something rattling softly on the enclosure.)
It's not my KEF LS50s, as it occurs on various headphones as well. When I listen on headphones, I can cause the buzzing to start and stop by turning EQ on and off.
This is easily replicated by listening to the Chesky Spanish Harlem with Rebecca Pidgeon (24 bit, 96kHz FLAC from HD Tracks)... other bass-heavy material (e.g. Charlie Haden's string bass on Duets) are fine because they seem to miss that particular frequency range (or they have a different harmonic structure? darned if I know.)
So if there are still any 976 owners out there who would care to listen to the first 30 seconds of that track (an audiophile standard that everybody seems to have) with phones or speakers and see if engaging EQ causes a buzzing or soft rattle on peaks, I'd appreciate it if you'd let me know.
This is going to drive me nuts now, and I certainly don't want to replace the 976, as there are no comparable AVRs anywhere near the same price, and I've invested in Hypex power amps that I want to keep.
Thanks
Phil
 
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